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BeitragVerfasst: 30.11.2007 15:09 
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gigi hat geschrieben:
znorter hat geschrieben:
...so you think a 24bit/48kHz will be ok???

As I wrote before: The SW sets the sampling rate at the S/PDIF interface to 44.1kHz.
I also doubt that the hifidelio-hardware is able to transmit more than 16bits@44.1kHz towards the AC97 chip, where the S/PDIF interface is connected to. But even it is, SW will not support it.


You have maybe the complete ID of the chip AC97 ??? (The number, etc...)

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BeitragVerfasst: 30.11.2007 19:06 
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znorter hat geschrieben:
You have maybe the complete ID of the chip AC97 ??? (The number, etc...)

It's an AD1981B

Vincent hat geschrieben:
The Opus 5 uses a 192kHz DAC so its hardware should allow for high res music. The other models are similar to the HF.

Yes, but I still doubt that the SW of the Opus will make use of more than 16/44.1kHz, even if the hardware is capable of more.


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BeitragVerfasst: 30.11.2007 23:28 
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...so, you think the problem is the firmware (2.3.18) but...from flac official site they wrote me HIRES is full compatible with 1.2.1 codec and the Olive firmware is full compatible with 1.2.1 flac...

Boh :O

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BeitragVerfasst: 02.12.2007 12:03 
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Today I have tryed:

HF via coaxial DGT output---›Lyngdorf DAC (44.1 to 96 kHz)
(firmware HF 2.3.18+ .flac file 24/88.2 downloaded from LINNRECORDS.COM)

The firmware of HF import correct, on the info you read "FLAC; 88.2kHz"

BUT


the DAC accept/read 44.1 kHz


So, I think...the data on HF are packed to 16/44.1 from "AD1981B" to coaxial and ptical outputs...
:(


It will be interessant what Olive team says...if all I have wrote is correct and HOW they have changed...IF they have :O


Luca, thank all.

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 Betreff des Beitrags: Re: test...
BeitragVerfasst: 02.12.2007 15:15 
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Thanks for the update!

znorter hat geschrieben:
It will be interessant what Olive team says...if all I have wrote is correct and HOW they have changed...IF they have :O


I once saw a picture of the inner parts of an Olive. All they have done was to add an additional DAC-converter-board into the HF.
- Digital Input to this board was taken directly from the digital output of the hifidelio.
- Analog output from this board was connected to the RCA-outputs of the hifidelio, while the internal AD1981B analog output was disconnected internally.

My conclusion was: No matter how "good" the DAC at the additional board is, it won't get more than 44.1/16 bits of data.

Well, some call it High-End, I call it cheating.


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BeitragVerfasst: 02.12.2007 15:41 
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Yes...gigi: correct!
:arrow: IF they put a better DAC connected to the DGT output of the HF (olive) IS a great stupxx things talking about resolution...
:arrow: IF they bypass the DGT output of the HF IT is a very good things, BUT...

I have seen that the internal D/D D/A of HF is made from the same (?) chip that is a "slave" clock of DSP...a typical economic kind of use the digitals...
So, it is very difficult to take the data stream from hard Disc/CDR player...
Mhmmmm...
Someone can help me?


L.


P.S. I have send 2 email to Oive's...just to know IF a new buyer can play the 24/96...befeore to buy. :wink:

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BeitragVerfasst: 02.12.2007 15:47 
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Theire are claims that an upsampling DAC sounds better.
Not because upsampling form 44 to 192 kHz in itself makes any sence, it simply remains exactly the same information but because of the filtering. The filters in the DAC at 192 kHz are less complex and less steep.

There are claims that a redbook audio CD played on a upsampling DAC sounds as good as a SACD.

Olive is doing what a lot of manufacturers are doing, buy a DAC from Burr-Brown (today TI). No cheating involved

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BeitragVerfasst: 02.12.2007 15:59 
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Yes, Vincent, but...

... "the problem" is that ALL you get from DGT output of the HF (chip AC97) is 16/44 and the data inside the harddisc are 24/96. So IF the "new" DAC recive 16/44 and outputs 24/96 (I DON'T THINK THAT these BURR BROWN does it!) we have 2 passages...

The right "hiend" mod IT must be take the data from Hdisc...but like you see my post there is no stand alone DAC there is ONE chip slave that does DSP and DAC...

L.

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BeitragVerfasst: 03.12.2007 00:56 
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Zitat:
So IF the "new" DAC recive 16/44 and outputs 24/96 (I DON'T THINK THAT these BURR BROWN does it!) we have 2 passages


Well, ask Burr Brown but it might be exactly what upsampling DACs are doing: increase sampling rate, interpolate and maybe ad a couple of bits and than do the conversion.
But it wont' solve your problem.
I'm afraid anything above 16/44 won't work on the HF.

Alternatives are
- a PC with a SPDIF soundcard capable of 24/96 or
- a USB-DAC like Benchmark DAC 1, Aqvox, etc.
Probably an easier and cheaper solution than redesiging the HF

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BeitragVerfasst: 03.12.2007 12:51 
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Mhmmm...
...the right thing is to take the 24/88.2 or 96 kHz from Hard Disc and send it to a digital output (xlr, rca, toslink). The firmware allows it...I hope...I will wait the Olive's team answer...

To upsample with a Burr Brown the sample rate FROM the HF chip IS a "bad" thing because we have 2 "passages" and IT IS THE SAME THING of connect a good DAC to the actual digital outputs: NOW I have this configuration an external DAC via coaxial (5 times more expansive and good of benchmark!) BUT the comparision of a CD with the same DAC and, of course, the same song ripped in .wav on the HF results better (a lot) with the CD.
So the problem IS NOT the DAC, but the HF outputs and probably the slave chip.


Sorry for my english...


Luca

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BeitragVerfasst: 03.12.2007 14:00 
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znorter hat geschrieben:
Mhmmm...
...the right thing is to take the 24/88.2 or 96 kHz from Hard Disc and send it to a digital output (xlr, rca, toslink). The firmware allows it...

Ok, now I give up. I told you in my first post, that the digital output (the HARDWARE) only supports 32kHz, 44.1kHz und 48kHz.

Zitat:
BUT the comparision of a CD with the same DAC and, of course, the same song ripped in .wav on the HF results better (a lot) with the CD.

??? In other words: If you play a CD with the Hifidelio and and a WAV with the Hifidelio you hear a difference? That can't be true.
If you play the CD with a CD-Player and hear a difference to the Hifidelio, then there must be something wrong with the digital output of your Hifidelio (Olive?).
Try to google for olive, DAC and jitter, two years ago a saw a website which claims that the olive digital output and DAC is pooly designed and probably worse than the on of the original hifidelio.


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BeitragVerfasst: 03.12.2007 15:48 
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(Sorry again for my english)

I have done the comparison with:

:arrow: Lyngdorf DAC connected with SONY SCD 777ES like transport (xlr cable)
and
HF via coaxial digital out playing the same file (.wav at 16/44) from Hard Disc (VdH cable).

So with the remote I can switch from original CD and HF that are used all of two like transport into the same DAC.

The CD was a lot of better!
Why?

The only answer is (IMHO) that the digital output of HF is a poor device.
So, I think that add a good DAC to HF is not the best way and IF Olive add a good Chip (BB) after the AD1981B it is the same thing to put a DAC after the digital out of the HF.
The only "right" thing is to bypass the AD1981B and take the data direct from hard Disc because in the Hard Disc there are the cleanest files...
I don't know If Olive make so...Hfidelio for SURE NOT!

Thank you for the patience...

L.

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BeitragVerfasst: 03.12.2007 17:54 
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znorter hat geschrieben:
The only answer is (IMHO) that the digital output of HF is a poor device.

Digital outputs are digital, either the data is correct or not. A "1" will stay a "1" and a "0" will stay a "0".
The only issue with digital outputs that could be a problem is jitter. A properly designed DAC could eliminate almost any jitter.
On my hifidelio, the digital output is bit perfect, i could easily verify this by transporting a DolbyDigital-5.1 or DTS .flac or .wav-stream to a surround receiver. If there would be transmission-problem, the connected surround-receiver could not decode the surround-stream.
This works perfectly for several users, so the hifidelio digital out is ok!

If you have a problem with it, it could be
a) that the olive in general has a problem with the digital out
b) that your particular olive has a defect
c) that your external DAC has some problems with the digital out of your olive, i.e. clock recovery does not work properly.

Zitat:
The only "right" thing is to bypass the AD1981B and take the data direct from hard Disc because in the Hard Disc there are the cleanest files...
I don't know If Olive make so...

No, as i said before: They put an additional DAC connected to the digital out of the hifidelio.


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 Betreff des Beitrags: Re: test...
BeitragVerfasst: 03.12.2007 18:34 
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gigi hat geschrieben:
I once saw a picture of the inner parts of an Olive. All they have done was to add an additional DAC-converter-board into the HF.
- Digital Input to this board was taken directly from the digital output of the hifidelio.
- Analog output from this board was connected to the RCA-outputs of the hifidelio, while the internal AD1981B analog output was disconnected internally.

Here's the link: http://www.aberdeencomponents.com/manufacturelist.htm


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BeitragVerfasst: 03.12.2007 18:53 
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Here a review of the Olive including some measurements. The incapability of reproducing high res data is also described.

http://www.stereophile.com/mediaservers ... index.html

Znorter,

You're obvious looking for a product with audiophile qualities, something you can't (and shouldn't) expect from a product targeted at the consumer market.
Maybe this is more to your likening
http://www.request.com/products/sseries.asp#specs
http://www.linn.co.uk/klimax_ds

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